Yay or nay.
Starting next Tuesday, Hwy. 403 through Mississauga will become the first major thoroughfare in Ontario to feature carpool lanes running in both directions.
The High-Occupancy Vehicle (HOV) lanes, running about 14 kilometres from Hwy. 401 to Hwy. 407, cost $47 million and took two years to build.
They will ease congestion and shorten commute times, Transportation Minister Harinder Takhar said today.
Presently, it takes about 19 minutes on average to travel along Hwy. 403 between Hwy. 401 and Hwy. 407. Takhar said carpoolers now will save up to 11 minutes, but adds there are other reasons to share cars, such as cutting fuel and maintenance costs in half.
HOV lanes are open only to buses or vehicles carrying at least two people, including the driver. They look like any other highway lane, except that they are marked by special signs and diamond symbols painted on the pavement. They are located in the left lane and are separated from general traffic lanes by a buffer area marked by painted white lines on the pavement. Drivers will enter and exit the HOV lane only at designated points.
"These lanes offer drivers carrying just one passenger a real advantage. By using HOV lanes, carpoolers could shorten commute times significantly during morning and afternoon rush
hour," said Takhar.
The Ontario Provincial Police will enforce the proper use of HOV lanes. Drivers caught using the lanes illegally earn three demerit points and face fines ranging from $60-$500. It will also be an offence to cross into or out of the carpool lane anywhere but the designated merge areas.
"The main purpose (is) to make maximum use of the highways," said Takhar, the MPP for Mississauga Centre. "Right now, the capacity on the highways is full. At any given time on Hwy. 403 there are 7,000 cars with only one person in it, which means at least 21,000 empty seats. So, we want to make best use of the capacity of the highway. HOV lanes will encourage people to carpool. We want to more or less reward the people who are carpooling."
If the HOV lanes are successful, the Province will look at expanding the program, said Takhar.
A portion of Hwy. 404, between Hwys. 7 and 401, will also have a carpool lane, but it runs southbound only.
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Here's where it gets fun..... If you're caught in the H.O.V. lane illegally... 500 dollars and 3 points.
Can you say government cash grab.
The government doesn't give a s**t about the traffic delays yadda yadda yadda..... It's just another oppertunity to gouge the people.
Discuss.
Are diamond lanes a good idea....or bad???
Good. Just get out of my way. I have a dummy sitting beside me.
I think the question is Anthony, what are the alternatives? Sure you can build more lanes without the carpool designation and those will ease traffic congestion for a short time until the number of cars increases to fill this new capacity.
However, at least with the carpool lane designation the number of cars using the new lanes will increase at a slower rate and it might actually convince those knobs in their Ford Extinctions to try carpooling, if only to save a few minutes.
My only real concern is what happens when it snows enough to cover the designation markers on the roads? Esp. for the entry & exit lanes.
NefCanuck
dollars to donuts, people are going to abuse the HOV lanes, so I says fine 'em.
what I find funny is that people are going to bitch and moan about having to carpool.
My question is what happens when you get stuck in the car pool lane behind the idiot doing exactly 100. If you can't get out of the lane to pass, are you really gonna save anytime? Especially if buses can use that lane, you know they don't drive much over the limit. So unless that lane is actually moving fast i can say that i'd prolly never use it when i could.
I say you can have your diamond lanes all you want. I doubt I'll be slowing down at all to let them in when it comes time to merge out to get on the off-ramp.
Maybe they'll make them "diamond off-ramps". :lol:
I think carpooling is a great idea, but not everybody can do it. My fellow carpooler wouldn't be interested in sleeping in the car for four hours if I get offered overtime, and neither would I if the situation was reversed.
Hmmm...give up $240 for the sake of splitting a $6 fuel bill? Not bloody likely...
I drive to work everyday and carpool, and it would be nice to have a carpool lane. I think theres discression if your "stuck" in a carpool lane you could fight it in court, etc.
But I think people who abuse these lanes should be set straight. Its like the diamond lanes in the city, everybody drives in them...because nothing is enforced...
The rich people of Toronto will abuse it.
What will be their excuse, "I thought the diamond in the lane meant it was for rich people and their SUV's with no one else in the vehicle. Hence the diamond."
hardk0re,Dec 6 2005, 03:38 PM Wrote:I drive to work everyday and carpool, and it would be nice to have a carpool lane. I think theres discression if your "stuck" in a carpool lane you could fight it in court, etc.
But I think people who abuse these lanes should be set straight. Its like the diamond lanes in the city, everybody drives in them...because nothing is enforced...
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Ohh trust me these will be enforeced, atleast for the first couple of weeks and then it will turn into the city streets. like every other project city does. Its in the news and TV every day and then something else comes up and everyone will forget about controling these lanes inluding OPP.
Plus OPP like 407 better. The only time i see OPP is on 407 ramps trying to bust the guys who block their plates.
hardk0re,Dec 6 2005, 10:38 AM Wrote:I drive to work everyday and carpool, and it would be nice to have a carpool lane. I think theres discression if your "stuck" in a carpool lane you could fight it in court, etc.
But I think people who abuse these lanes should be set straight. Its like the diamond lanes in the city, everybody drives in them...because nothing is enforced...
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Y'see the HOV lanes on the 403 were designed from the start so that the cops were gonna nail people for being in the HOV lanes illegally they could be pulled over and traffic could proceed around them.
The HOV lanes in Toronto have no such 'run off area" and as a result even if the cops wanted to nail people it would be next to impossible to find a safe place to do so without impeding the flow of traffic.
NefCanuck
It's a Good Thing.
Whether or not they're successful remains to be seen. It could go a long way to alleviate problems, or at least be a bit of a help.
ANTHONYD,Dec 6 2005, 02:42 PM Wrote:Here's where it gets fun..... If you're caught in the H.O.V. lane illegally... 500 dollars and 3 points.
Can you say government cash grab.
The government doesn't give a s**t about the traffic delays yadda yadda yadda..... It's just another oppertunity to gouge the people.
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How is it a cash grab? You don't want to pay? Keep your ass outta the lane its not rocket science nor is it something you can do accidentally. Its clearly marked and won't be difficult to see. Yes the gov't will get paid on the retarded who try and abuse it, but it's their fault not the gov'ts...
Don't blame the people who make something that other people might end up abusing, it would be similar to blaming gun manufacturers because people shoot other people.
Sure.
But really...why couldn't they open the lanes to normal traffic..... nope. let's see how we can make some dollas.
ANTHONYD,Dec 6 2005, 06:02 PM Wrote:Sure.
But really...why couldn't they open the lanes to normal traffic..... nope. let's see how we can make some dollas.
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huh? What are you talking about? MAKING money?
"The High-Occupancy Vehicle (HOV) lanes, running about 14 kilometres from Hwy. 401 to Hwy. 407, cost $47 million and took two years to build."
47 MILLION, if they wanted this to be a money making racket, they sure as hell went about it the wrong way....
47 million bucks divided by 500 bucks a ticket (which is the MAX, I am sure most offences will be much lower) but regardless, is 94,000 offences.
yes 94 THOUSAND tickets. This isn't a cash grab bro. Stop being such a downer. This is to encourage carpooling, and saving our ENVIROMENT. Don't bitch about something that is actually doing good. Now I don't think it will solve all the problems but it's a step in the right direction.
The gov't doesn't dump 47 million bucks into a stretch of highway, so it can "make money" off it. Pretty shiity return on investment bro.
Zoom,Dec 6 2005, 02:14 PM Wrote:The gov't doesn't dump 47 million bucks into a stretch of highway, so it can "make money" off it. Pretty shiity return on investment bro.
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You forgot the 407.
The government doesn't foot the bill. We all do. I'm sure that your neighbours in London like footing the bill for fighting traffic congestion in Toronto. Just like they subsidize GO and the TTC.
As long as they're extra lanes, I don't care. Chances of me using them are slim to none, I only go to Toronto under duress and usually at times when traffic is low anyways.
im gonna guess the the left lane (passing lane) will still be flowing better then this lane speed wise. and if you cant exit the HOV lane wheneever you want ur gonna get stuck there. "comuter lane" doesnt mean "fast lane" and if the rest of traffic is congested, how do you exit the HOV lanes and cross the normal lanes to exit. will this not lead to a backup in the HOV lane also?
ZX5focused,Dec 6 2005, 04:16 PM Wrote:im gonna guess the the left lane (passing lane) will still be flowing better then this lane speed wise. and if you cant exit the HOV lane wheneever you want ur gonna get stuck there. "comuter lane" doesnt mean "fast lane" and if the rest of traffic is congested, how do you exit the HOV lanes and cross the normal lanes to exit. will this not lead to a backup in the HOV lane also?
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From the above article:
Quote:Presently, it takes about 19 minutes on average to travel along Hwy. 403 between Hwy. 401 and Hwy. 407. Takhar said carpoolers now will save up to 11 minutes, but adds there are other reasons to share cars, such as cutting fuel and maintenance costs in half.
It would stand to reason that they expect it to move faster. But how much? Well, I'm doubting that if cops are looking for HOV offenders that anyone will get a bye on the speed limit as well.....
OAC_Sparky,Dec 6 2005, 04:09 PM Wrote:[ I only go to Toronto under duress and usually at times when traffic is low anyways.
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I go for wings. Wanna carpool for wings next time?
ok so lets see here, without any pictures of how it's laid out I have to only assume that these lanes run parrallel to the normal lanes. so if the normal lanes are all backed up and the diamonds lanes are not when the diamonds lanes dump into the normal ones would there not be a bottle neck there? and from the sounds of it there will be multiple ins and outs of the diamond lane unless there is some serious run off between them there will be yet another bottle neck.
Solve a problem create another.
we should make a west-end wings meet.
theres a st louis right at dundas and 403...
It'll give all of you the chance to check out the DIAMOND LANES!!!!