I'll start off by stating that I did not buy one and no one I know bought one.
There is a review/test of one in the latest S3 mag. They put it on a killer Honduh making a whopping 75.6 whp and 72.3 wtq in it's stockish form (short ram) This thing goes in the intake tube. It only runs at WOT. It requires 60 amps to run. It produces 800 cfm. That creates about 1 psi at all rpms. It made 6.7 hp and 1.6 lbs torque. It did however add 10 hp extra over 6100 rpm annd added as much as 7 lbs tq in the higher rpms. They list the cost at around 300 bux. I'm thinking that this might actually make some decent increase for the price. Especially if it was on a car with more than 75 hp. It also stated that a 5.0l engine only requires 450 cfm at redline (whatever the redline is???) Somebody buy one and let us know how it works. No I'm not gonna be the guinea pig.
I dunno, I'm still very skeptical but then again I seen that leaf blower dyno video a bit ago and it did make 'gains' even though it was extremely lame (the leaf blower).
S3, what mag is that? Abbreviated from what?
I doubt it would be too much use on more powerful engines.
It takes a certain amount of air to make a certain amount of horsepower. If an engine gets to a point where it's consuming more than 800CFM, the blower will become the bottleneck of the system.
1 cubic foot of air is 0.0807 lbs.
300 CFM = 24.21lbs of air. which is about 160 WHP on the focus.. so 160WHP is your break-even point for such a blower. But since you're also forcing air in at a faster speed, you'll see the greatest kick on long intake runners.
Could be an VERY legitimate SPI mod.... *shrug*
edit.. note that the electric fan only has enough power to push 1PSI, so it's obviously not working at full speed under 800CFM... so the trick would be to make an engine that can breath easily enough to get the 800CFM.. hence why you see the greatest gains at faster RPMS..
That thing always pushes 800 cfm. So if your engine is using 200 cfm then it has 600 cfm leftover. Since it is a fan and not a compressor it won't make boost with the extra air. But when your engine needs 600 cfm it still has extra air to keep positive pressure in the intake. If you think about the efficiency of the engine and intake system there will always be suction and the engine will be gasping for air. Gasping being loosely used. Basically your engine will never run at 100 % effieciency. With positive pressure it has a much better chance of filling the cylinders at high rpm.
Quote:300 CFM = 24.21lbs of air. which is about 160 WHP on the focus.. so 160WHP is your break-even point for such a blower. But since you're also forcing air in at a faster speed, you'll see the greatest kick on long intake runners.
I don't understand. It makes 800cfm not 300.
The only real drawback I see is that during normal part throttle driving you'd have a huge restriction in you air intake. WAIT!!!! Maybe it will act like the "tornado" and make you get 300 mpg!!!
bluetoy,Oct 19 2005, 05:36 PM Wrote:Maybe it will act like the "tornado" and make you get 300 mpg!!!
[right][snapback]150270[/snapback][/right]
sweet! maybe i could pad my stats :lol: !
This actually sounds quite interesting. If anyone wants to use my Auto as a guinea pig I'd be happy to volunteer it up. I'd need a beefier alt. but sounds like it's worth $300 for about 10whp... you'd spend that much on a good intake and pullies
bluetoy,Oct 19 2005, 06:36 PM Wrote:That thing always pushes 800 cfm. So if your engine is using 200 cfm then it has 600 cfm leftover. Since it is a fan and not a compressor it won't make boost with the extra air.
maybe the fan means to move 800 CFM all the time, but in a closed system where the air has nowhere to go, it can't push the air at all.. so you have options, compress it, bypass it, or stall it. A centrifugal compressor is really just an efficient fan..
if the fan was pushing 800 CFM of air all the time in a closed system, there would be more boost at low RPMs as the engine isn't consuming all the air flowing through the intake tract... sooner or later the boost pressure would exert enough pressure to stall the fan or the air (depending on how efficient the fan is).
just semantics I suppose.. (notice how I won't even compare it to positive displacement blowers).
All I was saying is that at 1 PSI across the RPM range, the fan isn't always able to push the full 800CFM.
Quote:But when your engine needs 600 cfm it still has extra air to keep positive pressure in the intake. If you think about the efficiency of the engine and intake system there will always be suction and the engine will be gasping for air. Gasping being loosely used. Basically your engine will never run at 100 % effieciency. With positive pressure it has a much better chance of filling the cylinders at high rpm.
thus the trick in this case is to make an engine that can breath more efficiently to get the air flow without backing up the system. A hopped up NA motor may benefit greatly from this.
Quote:I don't understand. It makes 800cfm not 300.
The only real drawback I see is that during normal part throttle driving you'd have a huge restriction in you air intake. WAIT!!!! Maybe it will act like the "tornado" and make you get 300 mpg!!!
sorry brain fart..
obviously if the fan can only keep 1PSI of pressure, it's not a very efficient fan, and while it would still be considered a restriction, perhaps it's not as big a restriction as it could be. I dunno.. that's why I don't think it'd be suitable for large horsepower applications. Even at part throttle, HP beasts would need more air than you could squeeze around this thing.
bluetoy,Oct 19 2005, 05:18 PM Wrote:It also stated that a 5.0l engine only requires 450 cfm at redline (whatever the redline is???)
Redline stock is between 6250 and 6800 rpm.
I know my 5.0, which is an '84, so it's carburated, is horribly under-carbed at 480 cfm... It run's out of breath by 5k. Nowhere near enough air with the stock carb.
Once you look at the EFI cars (1986-1993), even with the 55mm MAF, they flow 550 cfm. Upgrade the intake, heads and exhaust, and a well tuned 5.0 can take over 800 cfm.
Perhaps they should have got their numbers right. I call B.S. :thumbsdownsmileyanim:
Ryan
I PSI is peanuts tho... 1 PSI is something that you're close to "Creating" with a well-flowing intake anyways. Well not quite, but you get the idea. A higher-flowing intake that supplies as much air as the vacuum of the engine requires is really limited to the actual flow of the intake manifold or the throttle body.
If it takes how many pounds for even the lightly-boosted Focuses here to make any real power, divide the real HP gain by the amount of boost and you'll have a very weak way to calculate HP per lb. of boost.
What will happen here is that the SPI might pick up a bit of bottom-end as you're filling only half the intake runners below 3200RPM, but once those butterfly valves open at 3200, you're filling the second set of intake runners as well and the operating efficiency of said mod is cut in half.
I don't think it's worth attempting.
I really do believe in the electric s/c's they are going to give you something, perhaps something like a screw type or roots type s/c would have more success than some of these centrefugal units which require so much speed.
A high enough powered electric engine geared well could give you far more than 1psi, the problem I guess is the energy required, your battery would quickly drain should that be running all the time.
These little tiny motors I don't think will give much gains, but I'd like someone to buy this and prove it right or wrong with solid concrete unbiassed opinions on a dyno.
NOS2Go4Me,Oct 20 2005, 09:56 AM Wrote:I PSI is peanuts tho... 1 PSI is something that you're close to "Creating" with a well-flowing intake anyways. Well not quite, but you get the idea. A higher-flowing intake that supplies as much air as the vacuum of the engine requires is really limited to the actual flow of the intake manifold or the throttle body.
If it takes how many pounds for even the lightly-boosted Focuses here to make any real power, divide the real HP gain by the amount of boost and you'll have a very weak way to calculate HP per lb. of boost.
What will happen here is that the SPI might pick up a bit of bottom-end as you're filling only half the intake runners below 3200RPM, but once those butterfly valves open at 3200, you're filling the second set of intake runners as well and the operating efficiency of said mod is cut in half.
I don't think it's worth attempting.
[right][snapback]150364[/snapback][/right]
actually, if anything, it would give you the greatest gains when the runners are fully open.
since this fan is only generating 1PSI, it's going to basically allow your engine to breath without having to suck as hard. Hell, 800CFM is nearly 300HP of air capability. So any mod you make to make your engine breath better, you'd see a corresponding added gain from this fan.
remember, it's not the number of lbs of pressure you're running, but the amount of air your engine can consume. Lbs of pressure is just the leftovers of trying to cram too much into a restrictive system.
Here is the website on this thing. I was thinking of getting one when I owned the tempo just to give it more kick at WOT.
http://www.electricsupercharger.com/eramspecs.shtml
I am tempted to load one in the transam to get more air into the engine however I would have to modify the intake to take a pipe rather then the open air element that I have going on now.
talk is cheap someone make a homemade version of this and get back to us :)
would this thing work ( in theory ) without changing the ecu to work with the extra air flow or will it just compensate for it? and does it go before or after the MAF? or does that matter?