[darkpuppet]

from City News

Quote:Part Of Ontario's Pit Bull Law Struck Down
Friday March 23, 2007
It's the first crack in the dam of what could be a very big legal flood.

An Ontario Superior Court Justice has struck down parts of the province's controversial pitbull law.

The legislation, which bans the breeds outright in Ontario, has been bitterly opposed by advocates who claim only irresponsible owners are to blame for problems with the dogs.

The court ruled two key parts of the law, including the definition of what a pit bull is, are unconstitutional. And the jurist found using a veterinarian to prove a dog's breed also violates the law. 

Despite the outcome, the Attorney General - who pressed so hard to get the new legislation passed - insists 99 percent of the rules are still in place and that the vast majority of the law stands. 

"This means that the law continues, which means no more pit bulls in Ontario," contends Michael Bryant. "No pit bulls sold, bred or imported into the province of Ontario.

"People should continue to leash and muzzle their pit bulls; pit bulls are banned are in Ontario, and that has been upheld by the Ontario Superior Court.

"Pit bulls remain banned, the purebred definitions of pit bulls are banned, anything substantially similar to those purebreds are banned."

But it appears the lawyers for the other side are far from satisfied by this judgment.

"We saved 'pit bull terriers' but not the other breeds," a statement from Clayton Ruby's law firm reads. "We made it impossible for the Crown to prove its case with a piece of paper signed by a veterinarian."

They vow to continue to appeal until they get the law quashed or changed.

[ANTHONYD]

Blame the owner not the animal.

Pit bulls are beautiful dogs. We took our training with a couple of them. I've never seen such playful and calm dogs. The little pug caused more problems than the vicious pit bulls. :rolleyes:

[FocusGuy7476]

that is just wrong to completely ban a breed of dog, it is the owners that are the problem not the dogs in anyways.

the Ontario gov't starts to ban pit bulls next thing their going to do is start to ban any dog that attacks a person. The owners shouldn't be allowed to own dogs if they are using their pet as a weapon.

[Flofocus]

ANTHONYD,Mar 24 2007, 10:46 AM Wrote:Blame the owner not the animal.

Pit bulls are beautiful dogs. We took our training with a couple of them. I've never seen such playful and calm dogs. The little pug caused more problems than the vicious pit bulls. :rolleyes:
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Amazing heh. I just got the National Geo chennel and it has the dog whisperer on it. He's got his own 'pack' of dogs..about 15 of em, I'd say more than half are un altered bully breeds (Staff, pitbull, Bull terriers, etc). Don't know if you seen the show, but the way these dogs behave is incredible.

And you know whats funny...How come there is no more pitbull attacks in the media? I honestly doubt its because people are mussling their pitbulls now or that theyre going instinct or anything???? I certainly havent seen 1 pitbull in Ottawa muzzled, and I certainly dont muzzle my Staff Terrier

Michael Bryant is fawkin idiot anyways. Hope he gets mauled by a poodle.

[zx5power]

Its the owner not the dog if the dog is raised as a hateful dog well it might end up being wicked and look to bite but if its cared for and a baby it dont matter what kind of dog it is , My mother in laws dog is a german sheppard and you can haul her tongue but go try that to a sh i t zu it would bite your finger off then go for your ankles when you leave.

[darkpuppet]

I agree.. it's 100% the owner..

if people saw the Bichon Frise my mom has, they feel compelled to ban that breed too.. Raised just absolutely wrong.

[CanadaSVT]

I can't say it's 100% the owner. A co-workers Pit jumped the backyard fence and mauled a 89 year old woman while she was gardening. Her son happened to come by for a visit and heard the woman screaming. Somehow he distracted it while he got her inside. I'd been over to the owners house many times and the Pit seemed like a great dog. Dogs been destroyed but he still has another one.
I say to be safe, just ban the stupid animals. And while they're at it ban Chow Chows also. I had one growing up and that dog was a one family dog, wanted to kill any other person.
Try to think about how you'd feel if it was your mother,grandmother,gf,child, or yourself. Surgery don't heal all wounds.

[Flofocus]

CanadaSVT,Mar 30 2007, 03:39 PM Wrote:I say to be safe, just ban the stupid animals. And while they're at it ban Chow Chows also.  I had one growing up and that dog was a one family dog, wanted to kill any other person.
Try to think about how you'd feel if it was your mother,grandmother,gf,child, or yourself.  Surgery don't heal all wounds.
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While were at it, lets ban rotties, German shepards, Huskies, Dobermans, Great danes, Bouviers, Bull Mastifs

:rolleyes:

I never think about what could happen, I make sure that it doesn't happen. Anybody that owns this breed (or any large/dominant breed) should be aware of the damage they can do. I have a 6 foot high fenced in yard and I STILL go out with him everytime when he's locked down in the backyard.

[CanadaSVT]

Flofocus,Apr 2 2007, 08:52 AM Wrote:I have a 6 foot high fenced in yard and I STILL go out with him everytime when he's locked down in the backyard.
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Why? :rolleyes:

[Flofocus]

CanadaSVT,Apr 4 2007, 08:03 AM Wrote:

Flofocus,Apr 2 2007, 08:52 AM Wrote:I have a 6 foot high fenced in yard and I STILL go out with him everytime when he's locked down in the backyard.
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Why? :rolleyes:
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So he doesnt do something liek this...

Quote: A co-workers Pit jumped the backyard fence and mauled a 89 year old woman while she was gardening.

;)

If your co-worker was outside and keeping an eye on things, he could have stopped it before it happened. I do this with both the Huskly and the Staff terrier. Its called responsible dog ownership.

[ZTWsquared]

Flofocus,Apr 2 2007, 09:52 AM Wrote:While were at it, lets ban rotties, German shepards, Huskies, Dobermans, Great danes, Bouviers, Bull Mastifs

:rolleyes:

I never think about what could happen, I make sure that it doesn't happen.  Anybody that owns this breed (or any large/dominant breed) should be aware of the damage they can do.  I have a 6 foot high fenced in yard and I STILL go out with him everytime when he's locked down in the backyard.
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I don't know anyone who is in favour of this legislation who doesn't believe that the root cause of the problem is irresponsible dog owners ... but here's the rub: irresponsible ownership of a chihuahua results in an annoyance ... irresponsible ownership of a dog on the list you cite above results in a potentially lethal danger ... see the difference? Dog owners in general only have irresponsible dog owners to blame for any ban of a breed ... the rest of us are just doing what's necessary to mitigate the damage done by irresponsible dog ownership.

If there was any reasonable way to 100% ensure that irresponsible owners don't ever get a potentially lethal dog without a ban, I'd say let's do it ... if you can think of a way, I'm all ears.

And there's another difference ... unlike guns or powerful cars or anything else inanimate that's potentially dangerous to the public, dogs have a will of their own and they have breed specific abilities and tendencies that drive their behaviour with or without human intervention ... and depending on the breed, that behaviour can either represent no danger or a lot of danger to a person ... so there are other elements that factor into the potential danger a specific breed represents.

Just because they're pets and they have a special place in our society is no reason to throw good and common sense out the window when it comes to the safety and well being of our kids and anyone else at risk due to the irresponsible ownership of dogs capable of killing.

If dog owners in general can't control irresponsible dog owners, then they shouldn't be surprised or angered if other elements of society do it their way.

[Flofocus]

ZTWsquared,Apr 4 2007, 03:15 PM Wrote:

Flofocus,Apr 2 2007, 09:52 AM Wrote:While were at it, lets ban rotties, German shepards, Huskies, Dobermans, Great danes, Bouviers, Bull Mastifs

:rolleyes:

I never think about what could happen, I make sure that it doesn't happen.  Anybody that owns this breed (or any large/dominant breed) should be aware of the damage they can do.  I have a 6 foot high fenced in yard and I STILL go out with him everytime when he's locked down in the backyard.
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If there was any reasonable way to 100% ensure that irresponsible owners don't ever get a potentially lethal dog without a ban, I'd say let's do it ... if you can think of a way, I'm all ears.

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You and I have gone through this before...

We can't be 100% sure, but banning doesn't do anything. Great, youve taken away that pitbull breed dog from the guy that lets his dog sit at the end of the leash go crazy at the people walking by, but he quickly replaces it with one of the breeds I listed above....the dangerous dog legislation doesnt do much here, does it?

Theres a house down my street that has chocolate lab tied up in front. A freakin LAB, and this thing goes nuts at anything walking by. I'd hate for him to brake away one day.

ZTW, youve heard this from me before but for the others...when they were going through court for all of this, there was a lady that had lost a child to a dog attack...she explained her situation...similar as above, dog tied up in front yard and tried hacking away at people as they walked by. It was a siberian Husky. A responsible dog owner would know that dogs, any dog can get very aggresive when tied up to a leash/chain. This dog broke away from the leash and mauled this woman's child to death. They fought in court for a very long time to have the dog destroyed, only to see him playing with his new husky puppy a week later.

Liek she said in court, her problem wasn't a pitbull, it was a dumb owner that is clueless with dogs. Any dog.

[Flofocus]

ZTWsquared,Apr 4 2007, 03:15 PM Wrote:Just because they're pets and they have a special place in our society is no reason to throw good and common sense out the window when it comes to the safety and well being of our kids and anyone else at risk due to the irresponsible ownership of dogs capable of killing.
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lol, I'm thinking the same thing, just completely in the other direction ;)

[ZTWsquared]

Flofocus,Apr 4 2007, 04:28 PM Wrote:

ZTWsquared,Apr 4 2007, 03:15 PM Wrote:Just because they're pets and they have a special place in our society is no reason to throw good and common sense out the window when it comes to the safety and well being of our kids and anyone else at risk due to the irresponsible ownership of dogs capable of killing.
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lol, I'm thinking the same thing, just completely in the other direction ;)
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So you think common sense says "do nothing" ... because IIRC that's all your advocating. If so ... which of the following applies to you:

1) There is no problem.
2) Yeah people get mauled and killed by dogs but that's life - deal.
3) The problem isn't the dog it's the owner - let's punish the owner.
4) The dog isn't the problem, so there is no solution.

Frankly I'm not satisfied to sit back and do nothing. Is banning a breed the ideal solution? No. But in the absence of any other reasonable solution I'll take it.

All I've heard from the other side is ... "it's not fair, it's not right, it won't work" ... and to some degree all of those statements might be true. But what I haven't heard is a viable alternate solution.

If reasonable owners like you want to make sure that your breed and others don't have the same fate, then maybe as a group you'll start working towards better educating the irresponsible owners about who and what they put at risk.

And it's more than the safety and well-being of people at risk ... it's whether or not society is willing to accept certain breeds of dogs in our midst at all; or put another way, your priviledge of owning the breed you want is at risk.

In the meantime I will continue to advocate any idea that has some semblance of a solution because given what's at stake, even a half-assed solution is better than just sitting on your hands and doing nothing about it.

If nothing else this law has already proven to be successful because of the awareness its created and because it has people talking about a problem that's flown beneath the radar for far too long.

[Flofocus]

What Can I say? You obviously dont like the breed or else you wouldnt be supporting the ban so strongly. There is nothing I can say to you that will change your mind, same thing for me, you can type all day long, and I'll still think this bill was one of the biggest waste of tax payers money. If you think its protecting you, you really are kidding yourself.

And, yes, there is a problem. If your dog mauls somebody, you fawked up along the lines somewhere. Either you werent supervising them when they were off the leash, you let him get to close to something that he wasnt familiar with (kids, small animals), you left the front door open, whatever, in 99% of the cases I've read, it could have been prevented. Like you said, dogs have a mind of thier own and its up to the owner to control that mind & body.

Im not arguing with you...a pitbull was meant to fight and kill other dogs, they CAN be dangerous, but so can any other dog, and a rotty will cause much more damage than a pitty would. Pitties are a popular dog, so were german sheppards in the 80's, and I remember the picture the media painted about those dogs then. Same fawkin thing is happening right now with bullies. Theyre popular, people like em, so they buy em not knowing what this dog requires training wise. Yeah they probaly have one of the higher bite statistics, but Im sure theyre is more of them than any other breed. Last time I checked the humane sociaty's website, most were bull breed mixes.


And I do educate people on responsible dog ownership all the time. Frig, even the members here ask for my input when it comes to muts. I was watching the hockey game at my freinds house and he has a husky....my dogs gets along with other dogs but I still supervise them all the time. I went to the washroom (had to take one of those wing s***s :P ) and when I got out my dog wasnt there as he usually sits and waits for me. His wife put the dogs outside and left them. I got mad, I told her you shouldnt ever leave two dogs alone in the backyard....she thought I was kidding..."Hes a staff, you NEVER leave him alone with another dog" She still thought I was joking because she knows how well they get along...I had to explain that maybe theres a toy out there that Toot (his/her husky) is really fond of...Mac may go for it and Toot wont like that...Mac probably wont start the fight but I can promiss you he'll finsih it.

Now lets say he attacked a kid in the backyard, 1) its the parents fault for letting there kid play in somebody elses yard with a dog, and 2) it was my fault for taking that s*** and not being out there to supervise. A dog is a dog, there territorial, they'll do what a dog thinks is right.

But please....explain to me how does this ban protects you and your family from dangerous dogs?

[Flofocus]

And I'd also like to know if youve ever been around a well behaved bully? Why do you hate them so much? Is it because of the stuff you read in the paper? Why just pitbulls and not bullmastifs, rotties and say....a Cane Corso?

I see a lot of black people on Americas most wanted....must be the....nevermind. ;)

EDIT: last comment probably pisses some people off...I'm sorry, I'm not writing it to express my feelings, more to make a point.

[ZTWsquared]

Flofocus,Apr 4 2007, 06:27 PM Wrote:What Can I say?  You obviously dont like the breed or else you wouldnt be supporting the ban so strongly.  There is nothing I can say to you that will change your mind, same thing for me, you can type all day long, and I'll still think this bill was one of the biggest waste of tax payers money.  If you think its protecting you, you really are kidding yourself.

Don’t like the breed? – you’re way off base there man. What I don’t like, is that certain elements of our society don’t give a flyin’ fawk if they endanger other people by putting potentially lethal animals in situations where they can hurt or kill people – and I don’t give one rat’s ass what breed it is.

Flofocus,Apr 4 2007, 06:27 PM Wrote:And, yes, there is a problem.  If your dog mauls somebody, you fawked up along the lines somewhere.  Either you werent supervising them when they were off the leash, you let him get to close to something that he wasnt familiar with (kids, small animals), you left the front door open, whatever, in 99% of the cases I've read, it could have been prevented.  Like you said, dogs have a mind of thier own and its up to the owner to control that mind & body.

Excellent – we’re in total agreement here … there is a problem … dogs have a mind of their own … there is the potential for harm and death … so what’s your solution? Humans have been owning dogs since before recorded history but at one time the danger to people was more than offset by the advantages of having one – that’s no longer the case.

Flofocus,Apr 4 2007, 06:27 PM Wrote:I’m not arguing with you...a pitbull was meant to fight and kill other dogs, they CAN be dangerous, but so can any other dog, and a rotty will cause much more damage than a pitty would.

Great – we’re in agreement again about the potential for harm. But I disagree with your assertion that because a Rottweiler can cause more damage (according to you), Pitbulls should be ignored. And if that were in fact the case, I would imagine that Rottweillers would rule the dog pit – but AFAIK they don’t.

Flofocus,Apr 4 2007, 06:27 PM Wrote:Pitties are a popular dog, so were german sheppards in the 80's, and I remember the picture the media painted about those dogs then.  Same fawkin thing is happening right now with bullies.  Theyre popular, people like em, so they buy em not knowing what this dog requires training wise.  Yeah they probaly have one of the higher bite statistics, but Im sure theyre is more of them than any other breed.  Last time I checked the humane sociaty's website, most were bull breed mixes.

Gee … sounds like a problem to me. What’s your solution?

Flofocus,Apr 4 2007, 06:27 PM Wrote:And I do educate people on responsible dog ownership all the time.  Frig, even the members here ask for my input when it comes to muts.  I was watching the hockey game at my freinds house and he has a husky....my dogs gets along with other dogs but I still supervise them all the time.  I went to the washroom (had to take one of those wing s***s :P ) and when I got out my dog wasnt there as he usually sits and waits for me. His wife put the dogs outside and left them.  I got mad, I told her you shouldnt ever leave two dogs alone in the backyard....she thought I was kidding..."Hes a staff, you NEVER leave him alone with another dog"  She still thought I was joking because she knows how well they get along...I had to explain that maybe theres a toy out there that Toot (his/her husky) is really fond of...Mac may go for it and Toot wont like that...Mac probably wont start the fight but I can promiss you he'll finsih it.

And this story is supposed to make me think what … that even good dog owners can fawk up? That’s not a comforting thing to hear from someone who’s blaming the entire problem on irresponsible dog owners.

Flofocus,Apr 4 2007, 06:27 PM Wrote:Now lets say he attacked a kid in the backyard, 1) its the parents fault for letting there kid play in somebody elses yard with a dog, and 2) it was my fault for taking that s*** and not being out there to supervise.  A dog is a dog, there territorial, they'll do what a dog thinks is right.

Great – the one person not blamed in your scenario is the kid (thankfully) … however your last sentence says it all for me … it’s the dog’s instinct and dog’s will do what dog’s will do. My point exactly. But if the dog’s a terrier bred to go after rats and mice, then it’s not likely to attact something that’s the size of another dog … but a dog bred to attack and kill other dogs (or things the size of a dog) … well that’s a different story. So maybe one needs to be treated differently than the other.

Flofocus,Apr 4 2007, 06:27 PM Wrote:But please....explain to me how does this ban protects you and your family from dangerous dogs?[right][snapback]233275[/snapback][/right]

Okay … but it’s pretty simple and if you had an open mind about this it would be obvious even to you:

1) Awareness “A” … exposing the problem to the general public by way of the debate around the ban, means more people aware of the potential for danger and being able to recognize the special danger posed by certain breeds. Your backyard scenario is less likely to happen because even people who have no clue about dogs will likely have heard about the Pitbull ban and why and will be less likely to leave their kids alone with a dog.

2) Awareness “B” … exposing and emphasizing the problem, and general society’s view of the problem, to the good dog owners of the country. The less tolerant the good dog owners are of the bad ones, the less likely there are to be bad ones and the less likely breeders of certain breeds will be to sell their dogs to bad owners.

3) Awareness “C” … sending a message to the bad dog owners that their actions (or inaction) will be judged harshly by society and that the general population is becoming much less tolerant of a pet owner that doesn’t follow the rules and doesn’t remove the risk their pet might pose to others.

4) Less exposure to dangerous dogs “A” … over time the number of Pitbulls and Pitbull owners will decrease significantly; as opposed to the increase in numbers you noted above.

5) Less exposure to dangerous dogs “B” … those people who insist on owning a banned breed will be forced to keep them out of sight – they will be less likely to leave them in the yard where they can be seen and they will be much less likely to take them for a walk in the park or down the sidewalk.

6) Setting the precedent … once they get this law right and it stands the test of the Charter and the Supreme court, this ban will become the template for the banning of other breeds that you correctly identify as also being dangerous – a ban that will happen if dog owners don’t get their shi-ite together and adopt a zero tolerance themselves.

7) Forced creativity … perhaps if the good dog owners of the country truly understand that their privilege of dog ownership can be taken away, and will be if the problem isn’t solved, they might actually get involved in creating a real solution instead of wringing their hands and feeling sorry for themselves.

[ZTWsquared]

Flofocus,Apr 4 2007, 06:46 PM Wrote:And I'd also like to know if youve ever been around a well behaved bully?  Why do you hate them so much?  Is it because of the stuff you read in the paper?  Why just pitbulls and not bullmastifs, rotties and say....a Cane Corso?[right][snapback]233277[/snapback][/right]

If you think that this is about me hating a breed, then you haven't be paying attention. In fact hate doesn't play a role here at all ... and neither does unreasoned fear; although something closely related to fear is in fact at the heart of the matter for me.

The word is respect ... I respect what these animals are capable of ... I respect that they have natural instincts and tendencies that can put people at risk ... I respect that humans for centuries have been selectively breeding certain types of dogs to enhance specific characteristics ... characteristics that increase the potential for harm ... I respect that even good dog owners can have lapses of judgement and mishaps that they did not anticipate ... I respect that there are elements in our society who have no consideration whatsoever for the safety or well being of others, and these people have the same access to dangerous breeds as any good dog owner does ... and I respect that my 7 year old and my 4 year old simply are not old enough to understand the risks they face from certain dogs ... I respect the fact that my wife at 4'11" and 100 lbs is not only incapable of protecting my children from a Pitbull or similar, that she is in fact herself at risk ... and I respect the reality that I can't be with my family 24/7 and that I am forced to rely on the good sense of others, and the protection of our society, to help me keep my family safe.

If this ban saves just one person from a mauling or worse ... then it will have served its purpose and I will feel vindicated for my support of it. My personal believe is that over time it will significantly reduce the risk that we face from bad dog owners and dangerous dogs.

[Flofocus]

ZTWsquared,Apr 4 2007, 08:37 PM Wrote:If this ban saves just one person from a mauling or worse ... then it will have served its purpose and I will feel vindicated for my support of it. My personal believe is that over time it will significantly reduce the risk that we face from bad dog owners and dangerous dogs.
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Thats your personal beleif, great.

Def not mine. I don't see pitbulls being mussled by thier owners, I don't see puppies being put down that are being born today, Bylaw officers arent even enforcing it. I'll be buying another pup soon, wanna guess the breed? :D

How come the media isn't reporting pitbull attacks? Is it because all owners are mussling them? :lol: No because the hype has finally died down.

This ban is a smoke screen for people like you. People that are scared of something they don't understand, so when something like this comes up, a band-aid solution, your all for it. Good for you.

Instead of wasting money on something so retarded why doesnt the fag look into the real s***? I mean if your gonna spend money, do it right, but fawk Bryan MCFag do something right? FAWK NO.

1) Control Breeding and breeders with better laws. We bred dog agreesion in em, let's breed it out of them. Stop the puppy mills. Stop the breeders than churn these guys out @ $1200 a pop or more. All for the money....not for the love of a dogs. This will help a lot also on controlling the overpopulation of bully breeds, fawk, any overpopulation in our local humane societies.

2) Then we need to stop pitfighting....all across the world. It's really distrubing what this breed has to do to get some of their masters love. Runts of litters are tossed in fights between adults...they last about 10 secons, torn limb for limb. When a pit is losing and retreating and ignoring the masters commands to keep fighting, the master will not stop the fight, they will ususally let it go until the other dog has killed it, thats even if the competitor can move after a fight. They lose so much blood and have so much damage done to them that if they survive, they get fixed up by a vet, given some time off, in a small ass cage BTW, to heal, then sent to the pits again. Stongest are bred as a 'good dog'. I'm sure you can search yourself for some more, personally this makes me sick to my stomach so Im gonna stop...

3) Then we need to change our current licensing laws. Fawk this banning breed bulls*** :angry: :angry: . We have licenses for cars, guns, hunting, fishing, we need em for dogs. Obedience classes should be mandatory. When your even thinking about getting a dog, you should be in some sort of info seminar on teh available breeds and what the breed was about.

4)Change the perception. Get them out of DMX's music videos. Get the media to start reporting the good actions...ones that save lives, ones that sniff out cancer, ones that do search and rescue...

lol, I wish I could explain myself as well as you because I have so much to say about what you posted about the ban and its 'awarness' points. Amawrness to the general society? What theyre aware of is wrong. These dogs are great, loving and trusting dogs in the right hands. Look at AD's post about bumping into them at his obedience classes. Best behaved? Yeah, fawkin weird for a vicious dog heh? Many of my freinds say the same about my dogs. Both the Husky and pitbull. The scenarios above are just examples of what could happen. I know that if a kid was in the backyard my dogs wouldnt sattack, he was socialised properly but I still go out with them everyday, I'd hate for them to hurt the nieghboors cat, or get out somehow....you know. I love them, and always watch them. They've had spats though, favorite toy gets between them and dogs become dogs, the fighting is not encrouraged and they are scolded for doing it.

The things I listed above will educate people properly, not how this Ban is 'making people aware' (what a crock of s***) and at the same time set some laws for breeders to follow so we don't end up with a huge amount of strays in the humane society.

Oh and...Rotties have a higher jaw pressure per square inch than pitties. Yes they would cause more damage to human bones than a pitbull would. Dog Fighting is a completely different sick game.;)

Oh and ZTW, if your family is scared of this dog, why not get one? Help me prove to the population that these dogs are great...You heard the name "Nanny dog", these guys are great around kids, protective to ;). You'd also be helping by getting some of these guys a better home rather than a small ass cage at the humane society. The Best passive alarm system Ive ever had to. I go away to toronto or montreal for a couple of weeks and my wife feels COMPLETELY SAFE with him around her.

The media has done such a great job at paiting these guys to be ferocious killers that I can't help but laugh at anybody that beleives it.

If you have the national geo channel, I recommend you watch the dog whisperer. Half his pack is bullbreeds, he must like em for a reason...I mean they cant be that bad, were talking about the same breed that was around the rascal kids, Helen keller, and Michael J Fox. :P

[Flofocus]

ZTWsquared,Apr 4 2007, 08:18 PM Wrote:5) Less exposure to dangerous dogs “B” …  those people who insist on owning a banned breed will be forced to keep them out of sight – they will be less likely to leave them in the yard where they can be seen and they will be much less likely to take them for a walk in the park or down the sidewalk.
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Funny, I will replace my dog with a bully breed again. I truly love them. I will walk them in public, have him in my backyard and fight with whomever will try and take that dog away from me. I get the odd comment form ognorant people when i walk him now, that will never change wether its 1 year or 20 years from now. It doesnt bother me anymore, I used to stop and give them a peice of my mind, but I dont even bother with their ignorance anymore. The Ban has just added fuel for these people. I was hiking with both the husky and staff near my house, we bumped into a rotweiler...off leash. The dog charged at us, he came after Mac, I had to pull him away from being attacked and the owner gave ME s*** for not muzzling my 'pitbull'. I told her, he isnt a pitbull, and you should really have your dog on a leash if he doesnt obey your commands. Both of my dogs were on leashes BTW.

Thats a big thing that bothers me about this ban...how the fawk are you suppose to socialise your Bull breed when it isnt allowed in parks, can't be off leash, has to be muzzled...etc. This dog requires serious socialisation at a very young age, yet this law prevents responsible owners from doing just that. How is it helping the situation?