[darkpuppet]

meford4u,Jan 10 2006, 02:26 PM Wrote:Funny Steve.  Your asking us to clean up our own posts when you were part of the political shananigans. 

Remember this?

"vote bloc!

actually, you'd have to be absolutely retarded to vote in someone who'd split the country in half to suit their own agenda "

I think you get my point.  If you don't want this to turn into bedlam, then those at the top have to refrain from acting like those of us at the bottom.  And that's not sexual.
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There's a slight difference between making a facetious comment and calling people names, making crude comments, etc. You'll notice there are a few posts still in the thread that aren't 100% a part of the debate.

don't make me call you a big baby.

[PerfectSaiyan]

I heard that the conversatives hold a huge lead over the liberals in the polls.. who knows who will form the government, but in the end, I dont care.

[NOS2Go4Me]

darkpuppet,Jan 10 2006, 02:36 PM Wrote:

meford4u,Jan 10 2006, 02:26 PM Wrote:Funny Steve.  Your asking us to clean up our own posts when you were part of the political shananigans. 

Remember this?

"vote bloc!

actually, you'd have to be absolutely retarded to vote in someone who'd split the country in half to suit their own agenda "

I think you get my point.  If you don't want this to turn into bedlam, then those at the top have to refrain from acting like those of us at the bottom.  And that's not sexual.
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There's a slight difference between making a facetious comment and calling people names, making crude comments, etc. You'll notice there are a few posts still in the thread that aren't 100% a part of the debate.

don't make me call you a big baby.
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I'm surprised noone mentioned the melonballer! ;)

Bcak to the topic at hand: yes, the GST does bring in a significant amount of revenue. But given the fact Ontarians pay silly amounts of income tax already and the most tax nationally on purchases (unless I missed a tax increase somewhere in Canada), do we really need to tax all Canadians that much?

Do I need to mention the tax and subsequent revenue returned means that Ontario is on the short end of the stick by far? We're carrying a good chunk of the country by ourselves, and we have but deteriorating social, transportation and municipal infrastructures to show for it.

[meford4u]

darkpuppet,Jan 10 2006, 02:36 PM Wrote:

meford4u,Jan 10 2006, 02:26 PM Wrote:

don't make me call you a big baby.
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I think you just did.

But I win cause I know in that little baby mind of mine I am right!

[NefCanuck]

Y'know I can't understand why people think cutting income tax is perferable to cutting the GST.

Income taxes are taxes on income, if you don't make anything, you pay no tax, meaning that if you're at the low end of the income scale, a tax cut has a neligible effect.

The GST is a consumption tax and everyone pays it, rich or poor, frankly the GST credit that low incom earners get is a slap in the face in comparision to how much they actually spend on items to which the GST is attached.

Frankly I would think that it would be an easy choice to make, but maybe I'm missing something here :blink:

NefCanuck

[FocusGuy7476]

if no one looks at this country as a whole, it will never be unified. sure Ontario has its problems, its a local one go to your provincal or muncilple government.

Ontario and Quebec are taking too much from the federal government, all the citizen in that part of Canada have to stop thinking 'I, Ontario' and start to 'We, Canada'. We start to do that, then we won't become the 51st State.

[S2]

Yeah good point Tyler, there's more to 'Canada' then the Ontario region and I guarentee the west side of the country is going to vote the 'other' way the east side will (although I'm hearing even they are split).

It would be nice to see some 'benefits' come to the rest of the country also or at least equally.... .after all Canada is whole, not halves, quarters, etc.

[darkpuppet]

Funny thing is that northwestern ontario believes that southern ontario gets everything as well, and Toronto thinks it doesn't get it's fair share.. and saskatchewan says it's not getting a fair share.

Someone needs to sit down and see what the money distribution is...

if it were done by population, Ontario and Quebec would indeed get the extreme lion's share, but there's no reason why poorer provinces couldn't benefit (productively mind you) from the richer provinces.

[S2]

Yeah I agree.... population would obviously be the ratio in the split but there's 'crap' here for Saskatchewan. I work for the government here and the budget is pretty lame, even the cities are selling 'naming rights' on their attractions to fund city and local projects. What's next, that I don't want to know.

Last I heard, the police department here was actually on a hiring freeze due to budget problems when the department is currently about 70% of what it requires in size. Sad.....

Time to move to Alberta.....

[Casper]

I believe in voting nationally. My local candidates are backbenchers who follow the herd.

Conservatives: No way. Have never liked Harper. Don't want to become the US' lapdog. And I don't agree with their value system... gay marriage? My mom's a lesbian. I fully support her and her partner's right to marriage, if they so choose. The 'traditional' definition of marriage is a load of bull.... the word is part of the english language, and has a defined meaning. Because a bunch of closed-minded people choose to assign a particular meaning to it....

NDP: They have their hearts in the right places, but there is no realistic way you can increase spending on social programs, while cutting taxes, and hoping that everything works out. Layton is just happy that his party is finally at the point where they can be considered a REAL party. His power will come from being the swaying vote in a minority government. The favourite of my parents, as they're both union folk.

Liberal: The country is in its best fiscal shape than it has in a long time. The scandals suck, but every government does it. They were just the first to get caught. Sure, our social programs are suffering.... but there has to be some pain to correct the actions of past governments. By paying down the national debt, it will free up funds for social spending in future years. A good example of this was New Zealand. They were on the verge of national bankruptcy, until they slashed all social programs, paid down their national debt, and were able to come back in a major way.

I'm a mid-20's single male, working in the private sector (sub-prime lending), and the past 4 years under both Liberal provincial and federal governments have been GREAT for me. My mind was made up LONG ago.

[FociPhil]

S2,Jan 10 2006, 09:54 PM Wrote:Yeah I agree.... population would obviously be the ratio in the split but there's 'crap' here for Saskatchewan.  I work for the government here and the budget is pretty lame, even the cities are selling 'naming rights' on their attractions to fund city and local projects.  What's next, that I don't want to know.

Last I heard, the police department here was actually on a hiring freeze due to budget problems when the department is currently about 70% of what it requires in size.  Sad.....

Time to move to Alberta.....
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yet we have the highest crime rate in the counrty, and they wont hire more cops.

Well if it went by populetaion it would be Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver, and the rest of the courty is screwed.

[FocusGuy7476]

i do believe that something like a revenue sharing with the oil/gas. if there hasn't been there should be, the country is diverse enough to support a lot of different industries. forestry in BC, Oil/Gas/Ag in Man, Sask and Alberta, manufactuing in east and fishing in the maritimes. i hate to sound a little communist here, but we need to looking out for the greater good in this country. run everything like a large corporation, which i think Canada is, and we will be around for few hundred more years.

wish i was 21 so i could run for a party.

[meford4u]

Casper,Jan 10 2006, 05:12 PM Wrote:. The scandals suck, but every government does it. They were just the first to get caught. .
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Your kidding right? Because that is the lamest excuse for waisting taxpayers money I have ever heard.

No one. Not any government, not even the American government has ever been accused or involved in such a taxpayers ripoff. EVER.

They deserve to be in jail.

[2001 ZTS]

I'm going to generalize here but often think those who complain the most about government are the least likely to have a plan to govern their own lives. They are looking for someone to blame for their own ineffectiveness.

You see individuals, groups, regions and hell even entire provinces like that every day on the news.

[Kool_ZX3]

Peter Mckay could be a good prime minister, better then mulroney number 2.

I am voting liberal like i always have, Next election the liberals will again run New brunswick and kick bernard lord to the curb (thank god b/c he is a fackin idiot)

For one paul martin seems to care a little more about atlantic canada then harper does, my guess anyway. With harper as prime minister, expect the west to get special treatment(my opinion)

I like martin's plan for tax cuts,military,day care etc..

Harper's plan is just throw money at it to work like the day care, for anyone to think that 1200 bucks a year will fix it, well. The biggest problem is space, there is none and harper is not adressing it. :rolleyes: Also, waste money on building a base in the middle of nowhere, bang your head against a desk stephen. I have already asked friend's in the military about this, they think it's a big waste. There are more important parts of the military that need attention then that huge chunk of ice.

Like puppet said, the gst adds to the surplus which helps pay off the debt, i want the debt payed sooner, not later. Not to mention with the numbers now, the country will run a deficit to pay for it all. If that happens, way to go canada for electing a total dumbass.

gay marraige, one minute harper doesn't agree and will use the not withstanding claus to open it up again, now he says he won't use it. Make up your mind man, even the bloc and ndp agree with martin, leave it be and stop beating a dead horse. The man is a less dumb Dubbya, that's all. We will end up in the lap of the US. That's what boils me up, atleast martin has somewhat of a backbone. I would of loved to have seen harper when the whole softwood lumber situation come about, oh no against the US on a subject :rolleyes:

here is a good quote i found
"The primary weapon that the Conservatives have been using against the Liberals is the sponsorship scandal. Whether or not Martin is responsible for what happened, we should face the fact that attacking a politician, any politician for swindling money is like handing out speeding tickets at the Indy 500"

http://www.latchkey.net/columns/archives/2004_06.html

another good link
http://www.latchkey.net/columns/archives/001167.html

In the end i am pissed for what Jean's liberals did with the whole sponsorship scandal but to think harper would be a better prime minister, is a stretch.

"In terms of the unemployed, of which we have over a million-and-a-half, don't feel particularly bad for many of these people. They don't feel bad about it themselves, as long as they're receiving generous social assistance and unemployment insurance."

For that quote id like to punch that dirt bag puke square in the face and knock his ugly head off. Not everyone feels good about living on unemployment and welfare. made back in 97 or not, i don't think harper has really changed. Still really has no idea what to do.

[NOS2Go4Me]

meford4u,Jan 10 2006, 07:47 PM Wrote:

Casper,Jan 10 2006, 05:12 PM Wrote:. The scandals suck, but every government does it. They were just the first to get caught. .
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Your kidding right? Because that is the lamest excuse for waisting taxpayers money I have ever heard.

No one. Not any government, not even the American government has ever been accused or involved in such a taxpayers ripoff. EVER.

They deserve to be in jail.
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And the next time Ford horribly screws up, wastes consumers' money when they spend their hard-earned cash on a product they believe is superior, and then denies the matter completely when proven to a tee... we'll start firing the lot of the guys that worked on the project, jail the important ones and make an example out of them.

Ready? ZTW rear seat heat duct delete. Way to go Ford.

Give me a break Bryan. There have been scandals in Canada all the way back to when the country was first connected via railroad.

HAH! Found out I was right about the railroad one. Happy reading boys. This is just the "largest" to date because of inflation and larger number amounts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Canad...itical_scandals

[meford4u]

Did you notice 2 things there.

First, the current Gomery inquiry is not listed. That should easily top out your top 10.

Secondly, Jean and they boys and girls have single handedly put their own names and faces to 3 other scandals all in the space he and his government, who Paul MArtin was a member, were in power.

Remember the pepper spray incident at the Apec Summit?
The Human Resources Development boondoogle with the beloved HRD minister Jane Stewart.
Or how bout Shawinigate where his personal finances were involved in a property in his riding that received federal tax dollars.

This and the Gomery inquiry make the railroad scandal a joke.

And Adam, if Ford makes a mistake, you don't buy their cars. If corruption is present, people do go to jail (Enron is a great example)
So your idea of a rear seat delete is lame at best.
The Enron scandal in no way tops what the Liberals did. And people will go to jail in the US.

[NOS2Go4Me]

It's hardly lame, but because it's Ford and you're a (happy?) Ford employee, you're defending them. I don't think anyone here suffering a crucial feature "decontentment" would agree with you one bit.

I wasn't diminishing anything about the Gomery inquiry... yet you believe I am. Fitting.

I'll say it in CAPS because obviously you've misplaced your bifocals: SCANDALS ARE BAD, CURRENT OR OLD. VILIFYING ONE GOVERNMENT WHILE IGNORING THE CONDUCT OF OTHERS IS WRONG.

Is that clear enough for you? I'm not indemnifying the Liberals, I'm merely saying that if you think scandals and corruption are going away because you vote the Liberals out of power, you're sadly mistaken.

Governments are corrupt because power corrupts those who are without morals, independent of party affiliations. It takes a resilient and morally-sound person to serve in public office and to be paid by / entrusted with taxpayers' money. All I'm attemptiong to illustrate is that this has happened since Canada was formed, and it won't stop on January 23rd.

Make sense? If not, quit huffing fumes at work.

[meford4u]

Let's go back to how this started.

Casper said " The scandals suck, but every government does it. They were just the first to get caught. "


That was his first mistake and I tried to correct him

I said "No one. Not any government, not even the American government has ever been accused or involved in such a taxpayers ripoff. EVER."

And now you said "I wasn't diminishing anything about the Gomery inquiry... yet you believe I am"

And now you said "Is that clear enough for you? I'm not indemnifying the Liberals, I'm merely saying that if you think scandals and corruption are going away because you vote the Liberals out of power, you're sadly mistaken."

But the Liberals have the worst scandal record in the history of Canadian government. Why is it so hard to get thorugh to you that, in fact, by giving them your vote, you are in fact, and I'll use your words "VILIFYING" their actions.

And the paint sniffing BS is why you will always lose in an argument. It comes down to personal attacks and mudslinging for you all the time.

Screw off Adam. Your not worth aguing with as your description of weapons in space has me eluding to a picture of you watching too many Star Trek re-runs and wishing you were there. But I think you already are. In outer space.

[NOS2Go4Me]

meford4u,Jan 11 2006, 10:20 AM Wrote:Let's go back to how this started. 

Casper said  " The scandals suck, but every government does it. They were just the first to get caught. "


That was his first mistake and I tried to correct him

I said  "No one. Not any government, not even the American government has ever been accused or involved in such a taxpayers ripoff. EVER."

And now you said  "I wasn't diminishing anything about the Gomery inquiry... yet you believe I am"

And now you said "Is that clear enough for you? I'm not indemnifying the Liberals, I'm merely saying that if you think scandals and corruption are going away because you vote the Liberals out of power, you're sadly mistaken."

But the Liberals have the worst scandal record in the history of Canadian government.  Why is it so hard to get thorugh to you that, in fact, by giving them your vote, you are in fact, and I'll use your words "VILIFYING" their actions.

And the paint sniffing BS is why  you will always lose in an argument.  It comes down to personal attacks and mudslinging for you all the time.

Screw off Adam.  Your not worth aguing with as your description of weapons in space has me eluding to a picture of you watching too many Star Trek re-runs and wishing you were there.  But I think you already are.  In outer space.
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No, it's called sinking to YOUR level because you started on me about how it's MY party. YOU screw off, Bryan. You're a nice guy in person but you need a better hobby than antagonizing fellow members on here.