[Euro Ford Fan]

I've been talking to breeders reading lots over the past few months but I thought I would ask you guys what you think. I never had a dog before neither has Kristin so this will be totally new to us.

We are looking for a larger dog a German Shepard a Lab or Golden Retriever. I'm preferable to the German Shepard but Kristin wants a Golden Retriever. We are looking for a dog that can be trained to a high level and one that will be active. I run on average 2 miles a day and so does Kristin so this dog will get a pretty decent amount of exercise at least once but more likely twice a day. I'm not interested in a dog that doesn't have the mental capacity to be trained because I can't stand untrained or poorly trained dogs.

So got any suggestions?

[Phantom]

Look into Australian Shepherds really really smart dogs. Had them for years my dad breeds them. You can look at the site I made for him www.snozone.org

[darkpuppet]

well, in ranking smartest to dumbest, the order goes (for the top ten anyways)..
1 Border Collie
2 Poodle
3 German Shepherd
4 Golden Retriever
5 Doberman Pinscher
6 Shetland Sheepdog
7 Labrador Retriever
8 Papillon
9 Rottweiler
10 Australian Cattle Dog

I'll personally be getting myself an Australian Cattle Dog someday, but the one thing all these dogs have in common is that they need a lot of stimulation.

If you cannot guarantee at least an hour out of your day everyday for running or playing with the dog, you should find a more independent breed.

If you're getting a puppy, the breeder should be able to give you a personality test to match you with an appropriate dog...

when puppy comes home, be ready to let it outside every 2 hours (great practice for having a kid!).. the good news is that in a couple of months, the dog will develop a larger bladder and control, and the bi-hourly pee break will diminish.

Then it's a matter of training, feeding, cleaning dog crap and dealing with shedding.

[darkpuppet]

Phantom,Mar 28 2006, 02:36 PM Wrote:Look into Australian Shepherds really really smart dogs. Had them for years my dad breeds them. You can look at the site I made for him http://www.snozone.org
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I so want one of those dogs.. perfect for mountainbiking with.

[NOS2Go4Me]

Great Danes. They're the shiz. After you spend a day with a Dane, I dare you to tell me otherwise :)

[PerfectSaiyan]

my old German Sheppard had a very horrible temper, even though he was never abused and grew up with a healthy lifestyle. I would never get another.

I vote Golden Retriver, I have a Black Lab right now, and he is amazing!

[Euro Ford Fan]

Phantom,Mar 28 2006, 02:36 PM Wrote:Look into Australian Shepherds really really smart dogs. Had them for years my dad breeds them. You can look at the site I made for him www.snozone.org
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Size wise how do they compare to a German Shepard or a Lab? Looks like a super nice dog. Friendly? Can they swim, strange question I know but I want my dog to come out on the boat and if it can't swim that would be a big problem.

[Euro Ford Fan]

darkpuppet,Mar 28 2006, 02:36 PM Wrote:well, in ranking smartest to dumbest, the order goes (for the top ten anyways)..
1  Border Collie
2  Poodle
3  German Shepherd
4  Golden Retriever
5  Doberman Pinscher
6  Shetland Sheepdog
7  Labrador Retriever
8  Papillon
9  Rottweiler
10  Australian Cattle Dog

I'll personally be getting myself an Australian Cattle Dog someday, but the one thing all these dogs have in common is that they need a lot of stimulation.

If you cannot guarantee at least an hour out of your day everyday for running or playing with the dog, you should find a more independent breed.

If you're getting a puppy, the breeder should be able to give you a personality test to match you with an appropriate dog...

when puppy comes home, be ready to let it outside every 2 hours (great practice for having a kid!).. the good news is that in a couple of months, the dog will develop a larger bladder and control, and the bi-hourly pee break will diminish.

Then it's a matter of training, feeding, cleaning dog crap and dealing with shedding.
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Nice list Steve, some I like some i don't. I had one breeder give us a personality test and Kristin and I got distinctly different dog even though we both want the same things. One breeder said that we didn't have a big enough house to get a dog and even with the little bit of land we have and the exercise that we would give it daily it wouldn't be enough. I find it hard to believe since there are so many dogs that live in apartments and condos.

Since I work at home going outside every two hours won't be any trouble.

[Flofocus]

All of the breeds you just listed are very smart breeds, and should be relatively easy to train. I say easy because I've owned dogs all my life, and I've dealt with some stubborn breeds (my pitbull for 1, and our old great dane were very stubborn, not stupid, but stubborn and there is a difference). The german sheppard and lab will be better for running, the golden retriever is an active dog but not the best for a running partner.....I'm sure you could get away with him/her as a running partner though but Im pretty sure their stamina isnt as high as the sheppard or lab.

Now...the thing is with a german sheppard is they are VERY protective...all dogs will be protective of their master and property, but some just have a little bit more aggresive nature to them, like the GS. That breed can also be dog aggresive, so make sure you socialise the thing with many different type and sizes of dogs when you can, the earlier the better.

Training....most go to a professional but I'll say you can get away with freindly advice and reading lots of books. My tips for training....

-Put a bell at the door knob the minute you move your dog into its new house. Make sure its on a long lead so it can hit the bell with its paw, nose or whatever at the bottom of the door. Everytime you go out, grab the dogs paw, show him how to ring the bell, then go outside, let him/her do his business, praise them, when you get back in, give them a treat. Repeat, repeat, repeat. Try and do it at the same time everyday, that way your dog will get accustomed to a schedule and will make your life easier. You probably wont beleive me, but my dog has NEVER pee'd in the house, he got it really quick, 1st day. And hes stubborn....trust me!

-Start with basic commands, Like sit, lay down, give paw, etc right away. Most say that you cant train a dog until 6 months old....thats BS. My dog was sitting and giving his paw to people on command at 4 months old.

-If they pee/crap in the house dont grab their neck and shove their nose it in the stuff, its your fault for not letting the dog out in the 1st place. ;) A firm and loud "No" or "Bad dog" will be good enuff.

-Praise the dog when its being good, give it treats and lots of positive attention.

[Euro Ford Fan]

NOS: Hmmm just a bit bigger dog than I’m looking for.

PerfectSaiyan: I’ve been warned about the same thing even by a breeder who said it was genetic. Still I suppose there are as many good ones as bad. One of my friends as two labs a black and a brown, the black one is crazy trained but still jumps and nips, the brown is so laid back never been trained one of the best behaved dogs I’ve ever been around.

[Oscar The Grouch]

Wire Fox Terrier. My boss had one, too much energy for lazy people like me. But they like being outside and are fun when hiking/hunting.

[Euro Ford Fan]

Flofocus,Mar 28 2006, 02:52 PM Wrote:All of the breeds you just listed are very smart breeds, and should be relatively easy to train.  I say easy because I've owned dogs all my life, and I've dealt with some stubborn breeds (my pitbull for 1, and our old great dane were very stubborn, not stupid, but stubborn and there is a difference).  The german sheppard and lab will be better for running, the golden retriever is an active dog but not the best for a running partner.....I'm sure you could get away with him/her as a running partner though but Im pretty sure their stamina isnt as high as the sheppard or lab.

Now...the thing is with a german sheppard is they are VERY protective...all dogs will be protective of their master and property, but some just have a little bit more aggresive nature to them, like the GS.  That breed can also be dog aggresive, so make sure you socialise the thing with many different type and sizes of dogs when you can, the earlier the better. 

Training....most go to a professional but I'll say you can get away with freindly advice and reading lots of books.  My tips for training....

-Put a bell at the door knob the minute you move your dog into its new house.  Make sure its on a long lead so it can hit the bell with its paw, nose or whatever at the bottom of the door.  Everytime you go out, grab the dogs paw, show him how to ring the bell, then go outside, let him/her do his business, praise them, when you get back in, give them a treat.  Repeat, repeat, repeat.  Try and do it at the same time everyday, that way your dog will get accustomed to a schedule and will make your life easier.  You probably wont beleive me, but my dog has NEVER pee'd in the house, he got it really quick, 1st day.  And hes stubborn....trust me!

-Start with basic commands, Like sit, lay down, give paw, etc right away.  Most say that you cant train a dog until 6 months old....thats BS.  My dog was sitting and giving his paw to people on command at 4 months old.

-If they pee/crap in the house dont grab their neck and shove their nose it in the stuff, its your fault for not letting the dog out in the 1st place.  ;)  A firm and loud "No" or "Bad dog" will be good enuff.

-Praise the dog when its being good, give it treats and lots of positive attention.
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Fantastic information thanks!!! I've been told that GS's are more protective by nature one breeder told me that her dog will get up in the night and check each of the rooms in the house to make sure all is well then go back to sleep. I'm not a fast runner by any means so I don't think any breed would have trouble keeping up with me I'm more interested in one that could be trained to run with me while not jumping out at cars or racing off after anything that catches its attention. Lots of people have told me about socializing them early, the neighborhood I moved into has a dog park and club so there are lots of them around.

I like the bell idea! LOL

[darkpuppet]

Euro Ford Fan,Mar 28 2006, 02:50 PM Wrote:Nice list Steve, some I like some i don't.  I had one breeder give us a personality test and Kristin and I got distinctly different dog even though we both want the same things.  One breeder said that we didn't have a big enough house to get a dog and even with the little bit of land we have and the exercise that we would give it daily it wouldn't be enough.  I find it hard to believe since there are so many dogs that live in apartments and condos.

Since I work at home going outside every two hours won't be any trouble.
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You'd be surprised how many of those dogs are owned by the wrong people. A breeder who tells you your house is too small is looking after the welfare of the dog... while the dog can be raised fine, you're more suseptible to the problems of keeping large outdoor dogs in a small space.

[darkpuppet]

Euro Ford Fan,Mar 28 2006, 02:59 PM Wrote:...I'm more interested in one that could be trained to run with me while not jumping out at cars or racing off after anything that catches its attention.

I like the bell idea! LOL
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I'll vouch that the Australian Cattle dog seems especialy adept at this. A couple mountainbikers i know had cattle dogs, and it could run through the bush, alongside the rider, and not interfere with the rider or other riders on the trail. It may have been training, but I've never seen a dog as active, and as well behaved on busy trails as I've seen cattle dogs.

On the other hand I find labs, GS's, and retrievers extremely unpredictable on the trail... I literally hate it when people bring these dogs on the trails because I never know what they're going to do.

And I've been taken out by all of these breeds at least once... mostly them running into the side of my front wheel without warning.

[Flofocus]

I know its probably not on your radar.....But the best breed I've had so far is my Staff (pitbull). He is stubborn but once he knows I mean business he does the command. For exapmle, I'll tell him to 'Come', he'll look at me....I know he understood the command, but I'll have to repeat it with a more firm and louder voice, then he'll put his head down and take his sweet ass time coming to me.

Another great breed is my Siberian Husky....shes amazing. People say Huskys will run away as soon as they have the chance, out of the 2 we owned, yeah one ran away constantly, but that was our fault for not getting him fixed. Lilly (the new one) doesnt even require a leash to walk her. I'll bring both dogs for a walk and she just stays right beside me....the only time she'll wander is when cars are going by and she tries to get as close as possible to Mac (the pit) thinking she wont get hit by the car as long as shes with him....I dont know...shes just really scared of cars...at least she doesnt run towards them....lol

Honestly...now that I think about it....all my dogs have been really wonderful. Its all in the training!!

[Flofocus]

...and just to add to the pitbull thing. You can get one for free at your shelter...probably nice and young to. I've seen 2 or 3 go here in Ottawa @ 3 months old. The breed really needs good people like you to give it a better image...and to survive. I'm getting really sick of seeing mr white DMX with 3 at the end of the leash walking him.

[Phantom]

Euro Ford Fan,Mar 28 2006, 01:46 PM Wrote:

Phantom,Mar 28 2006, 02:36 PM Wrote:Look into Australian Shepherds really really smart dogs. Had them for years my dad breeds them. You can look at the site I made for him www.snozone.org
[right][snapback]177602[/snapback][/right]

Size wise how do they compare to a German Shepard or a Lab? Looks like a super nice dog. Friendly? Can they swim, strange question I know but I want my dog to come out on the boat and if it can't swim that would be a big problem.
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Yes they can swim. Breed standard says they are supposed to be standoffish. But they vary we have some that are the most outgoing in the world. Then some that will sit and bark and growl for a while. Varys on the dog. For the most part once they settle in with the new person they are good. Little kids like toddlers sometimes if you new to it can be a problem. Size wise they are similar to a german shepherd, roughly about 30-60~ lbs depending on male/female. And height can range from high 17" - 23/24" at the shoulders. But very smart dogs fast learners. And DP they are not the same as Australian cattle dog. Different breed altogther.

[Flofocus]

30-60lbs? Thats not close to german sheppard size....well not the ones Ive been near. Most sheppads I've met are in the 80-100 lbs range. Frig, both mine are in the 80 range and a GS would tower over them.

[Phantom]

Flofocus,Mar 28 2006, 05:01 PM Wrote:30-60lbs?  Thats not close to german sheppard size....well not the ones Ive been near.  Most sheppads I've met are in the 80-100 lbs range.  Frig, both mine are in the 80 range and a GS would tower over them.
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Those are big germans. When I get home I'll get my dog standards book and post em up.

[SangriaRedZX5]

Chocolate Labs... because I have one :)