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Hey guys,
What do you think the engine can take befor it give out. I mean PSI's. Like im running about 7-8psi on my car now. Im thinking of getting a boost controller but I wonder how high can I go on stock motor. Im getting my down pipe down when the snow melts.
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03-03-2007, 11:10 PM
(This post was last modified: 03-03-2007, 11:10 PM by hardk0re.)
>11PSI on stock internals(zetec) = inevitable kaboom
Definetly you WILL need a custom tune a J&S isn't a bad idea either.
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Same problem as the 4.6L in the S197 Mustangs...the stock block and heads were tested to support upto 800hp, but the stock internals are only good to around 500hp...
Think that you should run cosworth or equivalent forged internals, and then play with more PSI...
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well i run 8-9 psi but around 6000 - 7000rpm it spikes to 12, i say 12 is ok.
but you have to remeber that psi means nothing. 8 psi on a small turbo will produce a different power output than a large turbo at 8psi.
you cant measure in psi you have to measure hp. i could run a small turbo at 16psi and produce the same hp as a large turbo at 8 psi. it all about how much air your turbo can flow.
the safe limit for a stock zetec i think is around 250hp, then s*** starts to break,
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kamilk69,Mar 3 2007, 10:26 AM Wrote:well i run 8-9 psi but around 6000 - 7000rpm it spikes to 12, i say 12 is ok.
but you have to remeber that psi means nothing. 8 psi on a small turbo will produce a different power output than a large turbo at 8psi.
you cant measure in psi you have to measure hp. i could run a small turbo at 16psi and produce the same hp as a large turbo at 8 psi. it all about how much air your turbo can flow.
the safe limit for a stock zetec i think is around 250hp, then s*** starts to break,
[right][snapback]228821[/snapback][/right]
... to add to this its about efficiency. A small turbo pushing 16psi may be out of its efficiency and heating the charge air up allot more than a larger turbo pushing the same level of boost.
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Blah blah blah theres a bizzilion different intervals that could go around before blowing your motor. I'd say stick around 200-230whp and you should be ok. But as Kamilk said pushin the bars over 250whp you will break s***.
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Eric, stop it, please. You know me, you've seen what I've gone through. Get your exhaust work finished, get a custom dyno tune for 8psi and drive it.
Drive 15 minutes to cumberland, buy a zetec engine for $450 (i can get you a better price), build that while your driving a low 14, high 13 sec car.
I have an EBC but its kind of pointless. I can only play with boost between 8-12psi. Get your engine built, then buy a boost controller when u can really turn it up. Your turbo is cabable of some pretty high numbers.
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Flofocus,Mar 3 2007, 06:33 PM Wrote:Eric, stop it, please. You know me, you've seen what I've gone through. Get your exhaust work finished, get a custom dyno tune for 8psi and drive it.
Drive 15 minutes to cumberland, buy a zetec engine for $450 (i can get you a better price), build that while your driving a low 14, high 13 sec car.
I have an EBC but its kind of pointless. I can only play with boost between 8-12psi. Get your engine built, then buy a boost controller when u can really turn it up. Your turbo is cabable of some pretty high numbers.
[right][snapback]228857[/snapback][/right]
Im doing my exhaust work at the end of march. Im going custom 2.5". And if I see a big increase of power and I like it..I'll probably stay at that for this year.
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03-04-2007, 04:20 PM
(This post was last modified: 03-04-2007, 04:20 PM by ZX3_2NV.)
it all depends on your tune if your air fuel is ok then u should be fine but anything can happen i blew a piston running 10 psi, 220 horses on a basic tune the slightest thing can set anything off
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focusonthis_88,Mar 3 2007, 06:48 PM Wrote:Flofocus,Mar 3 2007, 06:33 PM Wrote:Eric, stop it, please.ÃÂ You know me, you've seen what I've gone through.ÃÂ Get your exhaust work finished, get a custom dyno tune for 8psi and drive it.
Drive 15 minutes to cumberland, buy a zetec engine for $450 (i can get you a better price), build that while your driving a low 14, high 13 sec car.
I have an EBC but its kind of pointless.ÃÂ I can only play with boost between 8-12psi.ÃÂ Get your engine built, then buy a boost controller when u can really turn it up.ÃÂ Your turbo is cabable of some pretty high numbers.
[right][snapback]228857[/snapback][/right]
Im doing my exhaust work at the end of march. Im going custom 2.5". And if I see a big increase of power and I like it..I'll probably stay at that for this year.
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I'd get a retune to. Michael said you dont go over 10 at all on the AFR ratio. Thats VERY rich.
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Flofocus,Mar 5 2007, 02:50 PM Wrote:I'd get a retune to. Michael said you dont go over 10 at all on the AFR ratio. Thats VERY rich.
[right][snapback]229005[/snapback][/right]
Where should I get it retuned? Im not going to PSI...
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woow dont go pass 10, you gas milage must suck.
my afr is around 10.8, on the base tune.
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if you change your exhast your turbo is going to spool difrent and make boost at diffrent times this = new tune...
a rich afr is better than a poor blown motor
a Wide band o2 and EGT guage are your best defeence.. if somthings gonna pop you'll see that condition there firsts and be able to pedal out of it....
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I could List my mods.. my times and even my future mods here.. but there the same as yours.. with a little less conversation and a lot more action!
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focusonthis_88,Mar 5 2007, 11:52 PM Wrote:Flofocus,Mar 5 2007, 02:50 PM Wrote:I'd get a retune to.ÃÂ Michael said you dont go over 10 at all on the AFR ratio.ÃÂ Thats VERY rich.
[right][snapback]229005[/snapback][/right]
Where should I get it retuned? Im not going to PSI...
[right][snapback]229051[/snapback][/right]
why not PSI? He's one of the best around. I wish I brought mine to him...may have saved me an engine. ;)
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ZED_not_zee,Mar 6 2007, 11:45 AM Wrote:if you change your exhast your turbo is going to spool difrent and make boost at diffrent times this = new tune...
a rich afr is better than a poor blown motor
[right][snapback]229085[/snapback][/right]
Not necessarily. Tons of Subaru and mitsu guys swap out to bigger turbos and bigger DP's and there is no need for a retune.
Yes, a rich AFR, is better than a blown motor, but there is something to say as "to safe" and sacrificing some easy whp.
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Flofocus,Mar 6 2007, 11:31 AM Wrote:ZED_not_zee,Mar 6 2007, 11:45 AM Wrote:if you change your exhast your turbo is going to spool difrent and make boost at diffrent times this = new tune...
a rich afr is better than a poor blown motor
[right][snapback]229085[/snapback][/right]
Not necessarily. Tons of Subaru and mitsu guys swap out to bigger turbos and bigger DP's and there is no need for a retune.
Yes, a rich AFR, is better than a blown motor, but there is something to say as "to safe" and sacrificing some easy whp.
[right][snapback]229091[/snapback][/right]
uhh of course those cars don't need a retune there ECU's are Made to respond to boost,,, they "retune" them selves... it's not until you do major modes you need to start giving more attention to the tune and at that point it's almost standalone time,,,
and it's true optimal AFR=optimal HP... an 10 is SUPER RICH I must admit!
I could List my mods.. my times and even my future mods here.. but there the same as yours.. with a little less conversation and a lot more action!
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Flofocus,Mar 6 2007, 12:28 PM Wrote:focusonthis_88,Mar 5 2007, 11:52 PM Wrote:Flofocus,Mar 5 2007, 02:50 PM Wrote:I'd get a retune to.ÃÂ Michael said you dont go over 10 at all on the AFR ratio.ÃÂ Thats VERY rich.
[right][snapback]229005[/snapback][/right]
Where should I get it retuned? Im not going to PSI...
[right][snapback]229051[/snapback][/right]
why not PSI? He's one of the best around. I wish I brought mine to him...may have saved me an engine. ;)
[right][snapback]229090[/snapback][/right]
He's always busy...He could only work on my car at the end of summer..I need to done sooner.
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ZED_not_zee,Mar 6 2007, 05:23 PM Wrote:Flofocus,Mar 6 2007, 11:31 AM Wrote:ZED_not_zee,Mar 6 2007, 11:45 AM Wrote:if you change your exhast your turbo is going to spool difrent and make boost at diffrent times this = new tune...
a rich afr is better than a poor blown motor
[right][snapback]229085[/snapback][/right]
Not necessarily. Tons of Subaru and mitsu guys swap out to bigger turbos and bigger DP's and there is no need for a retune.
Yes, a rich AFR, is better than a blown motor, but there is something to say as "to safe" and sacrificing some easy whp.
[right][snapback]229091[/snapback][/right]
uhh of course those cars don't need a retune there ECU's are Made to respond to boost,,, they "retune" them selves... it's not until you do major modes you need to start giving more attention to the tune and at that point it's almost standalone time,,,
and it's true optimal AFR=optimal HP... an 10 is SUPER RICH I must admit!
[right][snapback]229109[/snapback][/right]
What I was saying is I dont think Eric will need a retune because hes going to a bigger exhaust from the DP to flex. I was saying he needs a retune to get him into a safe AFR WITH power.
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[quote=Flofocus,Mar 7 2007, 01:25 AM]
[quote=ZED_not_zee,Mar 6 2007, 05:23 PM][quote=Flofocus,Mar 6 2007, 11:31 AM][quote=ZED_not_zee,Mar 6 2007, 11:45 AM]if you change your exhast your turbo is going to spool difrent and make boost at diffrent times this = new tune...
a rich afr is better than a poor blown motor
*Don't look just at the AFR , timing is very important when it comes to tuning, you can have detonation even at low 10 AFR if the timing is not right. The zetec engine(stock) does not like too much timing when boosting on pump gas. Also a good tuner should look at the overall picture;like MAF voltage,fuel pressure,IAT,knock sensor,EGT and so on... B)
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Kinda off topic, but how do you turbo guys in Ontario do at emission tests?
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