[Focused]

so i'm upgrading my computer finally....

what a world of difference since the last time i've had to do this serisouly....


can someone give me the low-down on what's up....

I"ll be using the computer for gaming, music processing [i have an in home studio], sufing for porn....etc.....i don't want a MAC...


so what's the deal with all the different socket sizes for motherboards...what's current....what's gettin' old....what's the differences between them....there is a PLETHORA of choices it seems...

as a far as video cards are concerned...


same thing....sooooo many choices....


I don't mind buying something that's a year or 2 old as far as technology is concered....i know i want AMD ....

let it be known i don't want to break the banks either....


just let me know what NOT to buy....and i can make a decision from there....i will need a motherboard, cpu, ram, video card....that's it.... up to $600 max total or less even if a GOOD buy is out there on cearance or what not....


i price out usually at tigerdirect, ncix, and canadacomputers.com



do you guys have opinions on these 2 items for starters?

motherboard

processor

^^^ with sufficient ram and a decent video card....how much of a dif. will i notice from my current setup:

p4 1.7
256rdram
intel Mobo

[scoobasteve]

I have a Socket 754 A64 3000+ and a New asus motherboard for sale in the FS section....

The only difference between the 2 platforms is recently AMD decided to make the s754 platform a value oriented platform. so the processors have a single channel memory controller vs 2 channel.

both 939 and 754 platforms will be phased out by q2 next year when amd releases the Socket M2 platform

Value Based Pc...

Amd 3000+ and Motherboard
1gb DDR
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?d...419&cid=RAM.178

DVD RW
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?d...6263&cid=CR.184

200 GB harddrive
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?d...06047&cid=HD.96

Soundcard
Audigy 2
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?d...d=006225&cid=SC

You don't really need a sound card, but if you use your computer as a home studio. you probably would be better off with something besides on board sound


AGP Vid Card
Geforce 6600 GT
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?d...295&cid=999.821

[scoobasteve]

Here's also an awesome tool for comparing Processor benchmarks

CPU Charts Toms hardware

[Oscar The Grouch]

I recommend the Asus A8N-e. I have one personnally and its good for moderate overclocking and is relatively cheap.

As for a processor, go with a 3200+ at least.

However, if you want to overclock that mutha, get a 3000+ and a DFI Ultra-D mobo. That sucker will overclock big time. Also get some good name brand ram if you're planning on overclocking.

Basically go with either as follows:


Overclocking:
A64 3000+
DFI Lan Party Ultra-D
1GB of ram (Good s**t, nothing with higher than Cas 2, get some good OCZ or Corsair)

Non-Overclocking:

A64 3500+
Asus A8N-E
1GB of Samsung Ram

In either case, get a Audigy 2zs sound card. You'll really know the difference between it and on-board.

[NOS2Go4Me]

Asus A8N-E motherboard
OCZ Performance DDR400 Rev. 3
AMD64 Venice 3500+
Thermaltake Venus 12 HSF
Asus Extreme X800XL 256MB VIVO

All of this equals a processor @ 2.53 GHz (it IS overclocked, however), which actually kicks my own machine's ass right now, and it can do video encoding via Firewire or S-Video / Composite-in. That's Sara's machine. The heatsink you won't need unless you overclock, and from what I'm reading you won't be. That's fine. Get an AMD64 Venice 3500 (2.2GHz), and you're laughing. Actually, I don't see how you can't game or do anything else with a 3200+ at 2GHz stock.

AMDs haul ass for everything. I stress the word EVERYTHING.

Actually, I just built the following for one of the guys that does general contracting for us at the office (Joe Cundari, Oscar):

AMD64 Venice 3000+ (1.8GHz)
1GB Samsung DDR400 (2x512MB)
200GB Maxtor SATA HD
Asus A8N-E motherboard
2 Sunon 4-pin (molex) 80mm fans for exhaust ports
NCIX SL9030-KL case - hey, even comes with a spare PSU
Nikao 520W PSU - well worth the money
LG DVD+-RW
MSI 6600GT 128MB PCI-E video card

Everything, tax and shipping in, including an OEM copy of WinXP Pro SP2... $1200 and change. The video card showed up FUBAR, so we sent it back under an automatic RMA... that's what I love about those guys... and the fact they're 3 hours behind makes dealing with it after work a snap. Kevin Ma @ ncix.com --> tha man.

[french_connection]

I just got a new system myself too.

P4 3.6 gig 2 meg cache
2 gig 600 ram
nvidia 7800 ultra
300 gig harddrive

22 inch monitor and secondary 19 flat screen

:P gotta love free s**t from work.

Regarding AMD, they always died early on me and are always more picky than intel when it comes down to running a wide range of apps.

AMD keep dying on me, but I do have all the old pentium I used since the late 90's and they are still all running. it tells a lot.

[NOS2Go4Me]

Got some proof on that 6+ year old crap Frenchy?

Name one program that an AMD won't run that Intel will. And the lack of optimizations thing doesn't count, either.

So you've got a Pentium 660 free from work? With DDR2 RAM. Free. And a brand-new video card. Huh?

Oh yeah, you work for EA. You guys get worked like mules, I guess you deserve it.

[scoobasteve]

Focused,Nov 7 2005, 05:37 PM Wrote:so i'm upgrading my computer finally....

what a world of difference since the last time i've had to do this serisouly....


can someone give me the low-down on what's up....

I"ll be using the computer for gaming, music processing [i have an in home studio], sufing for porn....etc.....i don't want a MAC...


so what's the deal with all the different socket sizes for motherboards...what's current....what's gettin' old....what's the differences between them....there is a PLETHORA of choices it seems...

as a far as video cards are concerned...


same thing....sooooo many choices....


I don't mind buying something that's a year or 2 old as far as technology is concered....i know i want AMD ....

let it be known i don't want to break the banks either....


just let me know what NOT to buy....and i can make a decision from there....i will need a motherboard, cpu, ram, video card....that's it.... up to $600 max total or less even if a GOOD buy is out there on cearance or what not....


i price out usually at tigerdirect, ncix, and canadacomputers.com



do you guys have opinions on these 2 items for starters?

motherboard

processor

^^^  with sufficient ram and a decent video card....how much of a dif. will i notice from my current setup:

p4 1.7
256rdram
intel Mobo
[right][snapback]154280[/snapback][/right]

[french_connection]

NOS2Go4Me,Nov 8 2005, 01:14 AM Wrote:Got some proof on that 6+ year old crap Frenchy?

Name one program that an AMD won't run that Intel will. And the lack of optimizations thing doesn't count, either.

So you've got a Pentium 660 free from work? With DDR2 RAM. Free. And a brand-new video card. Huh?

Oh yeah, you work for EA. You guys get worked like mules, I guess you deserve it.
[right][snapback]154304[/snapback][/right]

yeah man, well they are work related s**t and all. My web/home donkey is a P4 2.4 with 2 gig ram and ati 9800.


all I say is ADM always seemed more prone to fatal crash and also they DO die on me all the time, they cant take the excessive use I do of them where they process at 100% for days.


hell, I still have a pentium 166 that run and of at least 3 AMD, none ever survived.

that is work and home machines combined, we stopped using AMD at work approximatly 2 years ago.

[NOS2Go4Me]

Uhm... no offense man, but your builder is the biggest moron in the world.

Wife's box - see above. Runs @ 100% 24/7 doing Folding@Home. Temperature - 39C-41C.

Mine - described elsewhere, basically the same, slightly slower, same HSF - same core temps, same duties.

I measure the overall uptime in months before reboots for everything at home, that includes the Duron 750MHz running the F@H Diskless CD @ 100% load 24/7... months.

If they can't do full-load processing for days, then fire the retard building them and build them right.

It's easy for people to buy Dells and whatnot... they engineer the damn thing with a heatsink/heatpipe combo that's rated to take care of double the heat the processor will ever crank out. Presto, reliable, silent computers.

I have a Celeron 466MHz at home that runs my webserver. It's also @ 100% 24/7. It's in how you build and maintain the bastards, not a narrow perception of the architecture.

[NefCanuck]

Focused,Nov 7 2005, 06:37 PM Wrote:so i'm upgrading my computer finally....

what a world of difference since the last time i've had to do this serisouly....


can someone give me the low-down on what's up....

I"ll be using the computer for gaming, music processing [i have an in home studio], sufing for porn....etc.....i don't want a MAC...

do you guys have opinions on these 2 items for starters?

motherboard

processor

^^^  with sufficient ram and a decent video card....how much of a dif. will i notice from my current setup:

p4 1.7
256rdram
intel Mobo
[right][snapback]154280[/snapback][/right]

Here's one thing I can tell you right off the bat, if you only buy a "mid-level" machine now, in two years you'll be feeling the pinch to upgrade things based on what you've said you want to do.

Regarding video cards, buy yourself a motherboard that deals with the latest standard PCI-E(xpress) and a PCI-E card. AGP cards are being left in the dust and additionally, eventually all peripherial cards will be PCI-E as well (Think of PCI as a stock Focus, PCI-E is a Focus that's had a turbo slammed into it ;) )

HD space - The mantra is "as much as you think you need & half that again" programs aren't getting any lighter in their space demands and a small HD will bite you in the ass sooner than later.

RAM - 1GB is the bare minimum now, a lot of programs have mutated into RAM hogs, esp. games.

CPU - I run Intel, but that's because I'm overly cautious about making sure stuff works as opposed to sheer speed. AMD has long since matured into a viable alternative but their higher end processors are no longer the deals they once were vs. the comparable Intel chips cost wise (and don't even get me started on the ridiculous naming scheme that Intel came up with... I thought AMD's was stupid...)

If you have any questions yell, I've got good hearing :lol:

NefCanuck

[Aka]

I'd recommend an M-Audio soundcard. Though I they're not as great for games, they certainly do have some good stuff for recording music and whatnot.

[french_connection]

NOS2Go4Me,Nov 8 2005, 01:33 AM Wrote:Uhm... no offense man, but your builder is the biggest moron in the world.

ok, whatever... beleive me, the builder is totaly fine. I guess for "normal" use AMD's are good, Im glad you can have some stable ones, the builder we talk about is making over 100 machine a year for Super F@cking high end, so high end its called "DEVELOPPERS".

what we found out is that if we compare, we have more amd dying than intel, if we compare, they are less stable in general than intel...

I dont F@cking work for intel do I?

beleive me, I wanted to run AMD as they "on paper" appear so much nicer than intel, and lets face it, who doesnt like the under dog. But when it comes down to $ and serious production, we DO not want AMD.

thanks, thats all, if you wanna call people names, do it in PM. I was just giving my 0.02$ before you dragged me down and try to make me look like im saying s**t... <_<

[NOS2Go4Me]

And I've ripped apart countless Dells and countless homebuilds... I have processors that are well over 5 years old still going strong for both camps.

I'm calling the supposed master builder a flake. How can you build a system with an insanely-high (and verified many times over) TDP and then call it more stable? Maybe all your Intels are a fraction away from meltdown as well and you're running on the edge of lucky? Should I even ask if there's a decent amount of air coming out of the damn workstation? Is the air hot or slightly warmer than ambient?

I build this s**t like it's going out of style. I've even completely retrofitted Dell Precisions as need be... and recent stuff that we just couldn't get from Dell for the price point we wanted - RAID cards, etc. I'm not rating other people's s**t they've built for me at work when speaking about "my" experiences. I'm backing myself up. Or better yet, just ask Oscar. He's not a bad PC builder, either.

He asked for a gamer's PC. If he wanted a high-latency, high-heat, lower-framerate joke... I would have spec'd something Pentium 6XX.

Because you're accusing me now... what does your Pentium 6XX idle at? Full rip? Don't know? Or don't wanna reveal it. :rolleyes:

Whatever... Focused, good luck and don't let us "enthusiasts" or "bloatware authors"... I mean "developers" ruin your fun :D

I'm also dying to realize how scientific your comparisons are anyways, Frenchy. But wait, they aren't... you guys are too busy being slave-driven for objective testing.

NFS series rocks, the rest blows... and hopefully NHL06 doesn't suck ass. There's my quasi-support for EA today. Oops wait, C&C series kicks ass as well. Zero Hour is keeping me sane this week.

[french_connection]

nos, this s**t is stupid man, your right, maybe i just ran a luck streak and I was unlucky with amd.

and btw, I DO NOT WORK FOR EA.

I work for digital illusions...

ea is the publisher. ;)

[Focused]

can someone tell me the difference between thse 2 cards?


card #1

card #2


looks like #2 is a FAR better deal....no?

[darkpuppet]

Frenchy does have a point tho.. AMD can be fussy little machines. And the AMD 64 platform didn't do so well with 3d Graphics software written for Intel use.

Especially considering that rendering uses more CPU cycles and instruction pathing that you'd NEVER use for folding at home. It's akin to the problems graphics cards had when doom 3 first came out, it was just using parts of the chip that were never stressed to that extent before.

Generally, I find builders less receptive to AMD merely for the fact that they can't use the same combination of parts they'd be able to toss in an Intel machine. Performance be damned, how many people know about registered memory modules?

AMD vs Intel is similar to Windows vs Linux. One may be technically better, but one is definitely NOT as user friendly as the other. AMD is a bit more bleeding edge than Intel, but you pay for it if you don't research your high-end workstation thoroughly.

I'd recommend in this case to go with the AMD socket 939 dual core processor. You should still be able to get core upgrades down the road for it.

PCI express and SATA are obvious things in the next gen, and I may even suggest an ATI cross-fire capable card for doubling performance down the road.

But to be honest, I'm not one to go too far into processor names or CAS timings with people, as there's more to overall performance than picking the highest clock speeds and lowest latencies.

[darkpuppet]

Focused,Nov 8 2005, 11:51 AM Wrote:can someone tell me the difference between thse 2 cards?


card #1

card #2


looks like #2 is a FAR better deal....no?
[right][snapback]154438[/snapback][/right]

that depends, how much TV watching do you do on your ATI?

you pay a lot of extra money for the privelege, and with firewire video cameras, you don't need the all-in-wonder to do video editing... you definitely don't want to use it to capture sound... so it's pretty frivolous these days... Spend that money instead and get this card instead

or spend it on a sound blaster audigy pro.

[Focused]

yea, see, i have no use for anything TV on my video card....i've NEVER used it and never will...

as for a sound card...i don't need one ...covered there

[NOS2Go4Me]

Cause I respect you guys (all of you, even Frenchy ;) ) - it's the Intel compiler that was used, not the software. That's all I'm saying about said 3D software.

Oh, and if you want that type of card, both Oscar and my wife have it... the X800 XL version. It's worth the extra cheddar. 16 pixel pipes, not 8... 1GHz memory (500MHz base). Not sure what the pro runs at for memory clock, but it's a 8-pipe card or a 12... there's a significant gaming difference. PLEASE trust me on that.

http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?d...776&cid=999.243 - that's the card they both have, and my wife's was my card for all of 2 weeks. The only thing it CAN'T do is overclock. But it DOES do VIVO even. Very nice.

EDIT - their description of the XL is very, VERY wrong. The real specs for that card is 400MHz core clock, 490 or 500MHz base RAM clock (980MHz or 1GHz DDR) for the XL.

Their listed specs are for the Pro.